How to fill in a student loan form: Re: [BDSM-LegalIssues] Re: Arrested, ALL charges dismissed, career ruined WAS: You did, didn't you,

At 11:54 AM 1/8/2008, cadenas_sd wrote:
>--- In BDSM-LegalIssues@yahoogroups.com, "Malcolm Weir" <malc@...> wrote:
> >
> > You are conflating two uses of the word "evidence". One is the criminal
> > justice sense, where it is part of the process of establishing legal
>guilt
> > or innocense.
> >
> > The other is the plain English language one, in which it means
>"suggestive"
> > or "indicative".
> >
> > Like it or not, the fact that the principal got arrested is
> > EVIDENCE. It is not, of course, PROOF.
>
>Um, no. You are making up a second definition where none exists.
>Evidence in the judicial sense is the same as evidence in every other
>sense: indicative or suggestive, as you put it.
>
>You are glossing over the far more critical aspect: what it is
>evidence of. Nobody will deny that the fact that the principal has
>been arrested is valid evidence that at some point something happened
>that led to that arrest.
>
>But it is NOT evidence of *wrongdoing*. You just plain don't know what
>the "something" was that happened.

That someone got arrested is not evidence of ANY wrongdoing on the
part of the person arrested. If it were then why bother with collecting
evidence.

An arrest is at best evidence that the person placing another "under arrest"

A..) believes that wrongdoing has occurred and
the person arrested is the culprit or one of.
B.) is corrupt

That is ALL it means. Police in particular have
many internal rules and or court decisions
as to what things the police must have or
discover for what is referred to as "probable cause"
to make an arrest.

Definition of evidence from m-w.com (a rather well respected dictionary)

a: an outward sign
arrest is an outward sign that someone
believes. Not that wrongdoing happened but only
that someone believes that it did.

b: something that furnishes proof
arrest is something that furnishes proof that
A. someone sincerely believes that wrongdoing has occurred
B. someone is corrupt.

So the fact that someone is arrested is proof
only that someone is arrested. It is not possible for
the arrest to be proof of wrongdoing or even evidence of wrongdoing.

If the person were to sue for false arrest the
arrest record would be proof that they were arrested
and as such had standing to sue for false
arrest. It is not evidence of the falsehood or truth of the
arrest. It is only proof that an arrest did
happen to that person. Still no evidence of wrongdoing.

Now for amusement lets go back to the
beginning. Person A gets arrested and released in a matter of
hours. The actual culprit was arrested and
confesses to the crime for which Person A was arrested.

Company checks arrest records looking for matches
and finds Person A and fires him/her. Do you
think this should be so. Discuss.

-Vicki-

----------------------------------------------------------Main
Entry:
1ev·i·dence
Listen to the pronunciation of 1evidence

Pronunciation:
\ e-v -d n(t)s, -v - den(t)s\
Function:
noun
Date:
14th century
1 a: an outward sign :
<http://m-w.com/dictionary/indication>indication
b: something that furnishes proof :
<http://m-w.com/dictionary/testimony>testimony;
specifically : something legally submitted to a
tribunal to ascertain the truth of a matter2: one
who bears witness; especially : one who
voluntarily confesses a crime and testifies for
the prosecution against his accomplices

Main Entry:
2evidence
Function:
transitive verb
Inflected Form(s):
evidenced; evidenc·ing
Date:
circa 1610
: to offer evidence of :
<http://m-w.com/dictionary/prove>prove
<http://m-w.com/dictionary/evince>evince
synonyms see <http://m-w.com/dictionary/show>show

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Tuesday, January 8, 2008

Re: [BDSM-LegalIssues] Re: Arrested, ALL charges dismissed, career ruined WAS: You did, didn't you,

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